Dog training methods…what happens when positive doesn’t work?
Question by Dogs are the kindest creatures: Dog training methods…what happens when positive doesn’t work?
Okay so I have known quite a few dogs that this new age Reward positive training method has worked wonderfully on. One of my dogs included.
I have also known several that it doesn’t work on. I have known several dogs that were trained by being scolded and told no, being crated for punishment. Who have been really great dogs as well.
I have also known dogs that have used either of these methods and have been holy terrors.
So I see a lot of conflict between these methods but my question is as long as the dog is well trained, loved, cared for, treated right, not abused or mal nourished. than what does it matter what method you use as long as it works?
Personally I loved our trainer, she did reward training and for our dog that was wonderful. But I have known dogs that take reward training and run with it and are worse dogs for it. Even when trained properly with reward training.
So that is why I ask. As long as the dog is trained and in no harm and loved and cared for, what difference does it make if the dog is trained by rewards or punishment/correction (again as long as no physical harm comes to the dog, I’m not talking about hitting a dog or anything like that)
ADD: Just asking out of curiosity.
Best answer:
Answer by elaine n
I think dogs are individuals. What works for one may not be the best thing for the other. I also believe you can blend the two methods. I recently heard of a training class that forbids “choke” chain collars or pinch collars and I think that is kind of stupid. Good trainers and owners need to be constantly evaluating and modifying their training methods based on how the dog responds.
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I think you should use whatever method works for that particular dog. Just like our 2 legged children our four legged kids all have different personalities and each respond to different things. As long as you are providing a safe and proper home you are doing the right thing for your dog. At least you seem concerned in training your dog. There so many people that don’t see the need to make their behave.
Some dogs learn by positive reinforcement, some don’t. It doesnt really matter what method you use though alot of people are against negative reinforcement. Though sometimes you have to use negative reinforcement. I sometimes spank dogs that are bad (there is a difference between spanking and hitting. hitting is abusive and hurts the dog. spanking is giving the dog some hard pats on the butt to get the message across.) for example, if my dog has been trained to go outside and makes a mess inside, I stick his/her nose in it and spank him/her while saying “NO”. You have to be consistent with what word you use or they wont understand. You also cant administer negative reinforcement if you dont catch the dog in the act.
One thing I learned years ago, when training horses:
Given the same horse – two different trainers with COMPLETELY different approaches can produce the same result.
Im sure its the same with dogs..animals are animals. So I judge by results.
People will, of course have their preferred approaches, and it will differ with the person, but if someone can get the same result with a different approach than I use, more power to them.
I agree. My opinion is whatever works best for you and the dog. As long as the dog gets trained properly and is under control who cares if it was trained with treats? Trainers who train according to rewards such as treats and trainers who train according to corrections both can produce well-trained reliable dogs.
Tess is rewarded with treats and toys when first learning a command, after a few days the treats and toys are taken away all together and her only praise is a “good girl”. If she doesn’t do the command i want, first time, then that’s when the correction comes in.
When Tess was a puppy she used to pretty much work for treats and not me…not the best of things when you in a situation near a road and the dogs of leash..huh? So i decided i’d change the way i train. Use treats for the learning part, then when she knew what was being asked of her, the rewards where eliminated. Failure to do so on first command, a correction is made.
Tess is 99% trained, reliably. When i ask her to come, she comes first time, the same with sit, down, stay etc. She does not come quivering and shaking towards me, she knows she will get a reward of a “good girl” or a pat on the head but she also knows that if she doesn’t act to the command given first time, i will most definitely follow through with a correction, first time.
Training is not one size fits all. Many people think that force methods, such as training with a shock collar, such as for hunting or field trials, is cruel. However it is almost always very effective if done well. Additionally, for me at least, you need to balance the pros and cons. While a rewarded dog is a happy dog, so is one that knows the rules and pleases its owner. Also, a well trained dog is a safe dog. If I had to make the choice between using a shock collar to ensure that my dog comes back to me 100% of the time, or taking the chance that he get hit by a car, I’d take the collar.
I use both and it works for me. My dogs know they’re well loved, but they also know and follow the rules that keep everyone happy. This also means I get to take them more places and allow them more freedom- which they love.
Good luck, and thanks for looking into training options instead of giving up and having unruly, untrained dogs!
I think it’s a misconception that positive trainers don’t use punishment. We just use negative punishment.
I’ve never had a problem with it. All of my dogs have been individuals…
I believe that you should use what works for you and the dog. The same training methods don’t work for every person and every dog.
However I do not believe dogs can be trained on 100% positive training. At one point or another, you have to issue a correction, whether it be a leash pop or a simple “No.” Believe it or not people, this is a correction too you know.
I believe every type of training also has some type or reward- Praise is a reward too, it doesn’t HAVE to be food.